Sima moves a major step toward a darkened winter
A total of $65,700 is not enough to ensure the success of Mount Sima, or is it?
By Stephanie Waddell on September 24, 2013
A total of $65,700 is not enough to ensure the success of Mount Sima, or is it?
That was the question city council debated for more than an hour Monday evening before a 4-2 vote defeated a motion to provide the cash to the Friends of Mount Sima and to study supplying a bus to the ski hill through this winter.
The Friends group is working to get the hill reopened since its closure in July in the midst of its second season of summer operations.
While that group works on reopening, the current organization in charge of the hill – the Great Northern Ski Society (GNSS) – is dealing with getting out of debt so it can dissolve.
The Friends of Sima had most recently asked the city for $200,000 to get the hill reopened.
On Monday evening, however, it came forward with a proposal for $72,500 after learning user groups would donate the $20,000 each they're set to receive from the 2012 Arctic Winter Games legacy fund for a total of $60,000.
The group also proposed that potential contingencies – such as mechanical breakdowns and so on – could be handled with the help of the city and Yukon government, pending further
discussions.
City administration had recommended that $65,700 go to the society.
Councillors John Streicker and Kirk Cameron were the only members of council to vote in favour of providing the funding, while Coun. Dave Stockdale was absent from the vote.
Streicker and Cameron made impassioned speeches in favour of financial support for the hill, but they were not enough to convince the rest of council.
As Streicker pointed out, the city will end up paying $65,700 regardless of whether it's given to the Friends Of Sima in their efforts to reopen or if it's mothballed – in which case, the city will be responsible for the site.
Under the lease for the land with the GNSS, the facilities at the hill revert to the city if the lease is broken.
The city also paid off the nearly $200,000 GNSS debt on the lift and took over title of the quad chair, with the Yukon government paying off about the same in GNSS debt to local creditors.
Negotiations are in the works with WildPlay for the adventure park being run at the hill through the summer. WildPlay had just started the second year of its 10-year lease at the hill when it was closed.
If the hill is idled, the city would be responsible for the facility, and could keep it in a state of dormancy – in case it can reopen in the future – at a cost of $65,700.
As Streicker said, that means the decision comes down to paying $65,700 to not have it opened or $65,700 so the Friends of Mount Sima can try to open it.
Either way, the effect would be the same on taxpayers, and he would rather give it to the skiers and snowboarders than to caretakers.
Cameron pointed to the economic, social and health benefits of the hill, noting an "A-Team” of business leaders has been calling for support to the hill.
As the conversation moved to a matter of trust with the new group looking at running Sima, Cameron said: "I'm fully prepared to trust.”
He and Streicker noted the Friends of Sima group has done everything it has been asked by the city, in garnering public support.
Streicker was successful in an initial amendment that, if approved, the cash would be conditional on the Friends of Mount Sima collecting at least half of the 800 pledges made by residents to purchase a season's pass by Oct. 31.
As the debate continued on the main motion, however, it became clear most other council members wouldn't support the funding, though they made a point of stating their desire to see the ski hill operate.
Coun. Mike Gladish works full-time in winter recreation as the manager of the Whitehorse Cross Country Ski Club.
He argued that $65,000 is not enough to make a difference for the reopening of Sima and that eight weeks are just not long enough to come up with a solid business plan.
"We have to be objective,” Gladish said.
If the hill closes for the year, he added, it would give the Friends of Sima more time to get things in order to reopen for the 2014 season.
He also recalled the last time Sima was shut for a season, in the winter of 2007/2008, noting it did not "make or break” his daughter's love of snowboarding. She returned to the sport the following winter and has continued to enjoy it, he said
He also stressed he needs to see money in the bank to know the community support is there.
Cameron was quick to remind Gladish that from time to time, various recreational groups have struggled, including the cross-country ski club, and the city has assisted.
The haste and pressure of the vote bothered Councillors Jocelyn Curteanu and Betty Irwin.
"Haste makes waste, and I don't want to waste that hill,” Curteanu said.
If the city provides $65,700 now, she added, it may not be enough to keep the hill operating this season.
That could mean the Friends of Sima calling on the city for funding again in order for it to survive the season. And support just might not be there at that point, Curteanu said.
"I want that hill, not just for the season; I want it for the century,” she said after reflecting on how difficult Monday's vote was for her.
Like other members of council, she praised the extensive work the Friends of Sima have done to rally support and have the hill reopened.
Curteanu also said eight weeks aren't enough to dissect what went wrong for the GNSS when it was running the hill and what can be learned for future operations.
Irwin commended the Friends, stating, "I do feel the Friends of Sima have gone a long way.”
However, the city is being pressured into making a swift decision, she added, and there are too many uncertainties around it.
It was only two weeks ago that Friends of Sima member Laurie Henderson told council anything less than $200,000 from the city would mean uncertainty for the hill.
"There is no certainty the hill will be able to reopen,” Irwin said before stating her belief Sima should close for a year.
Sorry skiers and snowboarders, she said, it won't mean the end of the world.
Supporters should be able to hold their convictions for a year to get things operating in 2014 with more planning, she added.
While Mayor Dan Curtis remained quiet throughout the discussion, just before the vote, he commented that his position, which he has stated in the past, hasn't changed.
In previous interviews, he stated his fear that providing $65,700 would not be enough and would essentially set up the Friends of Sima up for failure.
He has also said the city just doesn't have the money supporters are looking for.
Boosters were unsure what direction the Friends of Sima will take following last night's vote.
See related coverage and letter.
Comments (17)
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Wolfe on Oct 1, 2013 at 8:19 am
Don,
That's the attitude my friend. How about this for a thought.
If some of you highly paid so called "volunteers" actually stepped up to the plate and did volunteer their time, perhaps the hill would operate.
But, oh no, now that your gravy train is gone you are all prepared to let the entire place collapse.
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Don McLaughlin on Oct 1, 2013 at 6:42 am
In response to some of the less intelligent comments made about the saga of Mount Sima.
-To those that say ski at Watson Lake: Mt Maichen is a great little community hill for Watson Lake but it is no destination resort. I know it well but it cannot replace Mt. Sima as a ski area for Whitehorse. If you are going to drive that far you are going to want something equivalent to Big White or Silver Star at the end of the road.
-To those who say Mt. Sima should have been located elsewhere: Please present some facts from your research or otherwise your words are worthless. Real skiers and riders love Mt. Sima. The quality of the ski area is not the problem. By the way for those uninformed experts, Mt. Sima does have a T-bar tow.
-To those that would like to see an audit: There are 21 years of financial statements posted on Mt. Sima's web site. 2013 is not there yet. If they are not good enough for you, you can put some money where your mouth is and hire your own accountant to go over them for you. I don't believe that you will find any skeletons in any closets or any misappropriation of any funds.
-Grants: Yes, Mt. Sima received several grants over the years and most was for capital and not for operating costs. All the grants in the early years came from YTG. The CoW did start providing some recreation grant money starting about the year 2000 at about $5-$6,000 (AWG's) and again prior to the CWG's. I believe that YTG, as one of the Territory's largest employers, recognized Mt. Sima as an important outdoor winter recreation amenity when trying to attract the best and brightest from those areas of Canada where skiing and riding are popular winter activities.
-Operating costs: Many have pointed to examples of the excellence of the City's multipurpose facilities but they fail to mention that user fees only cover about 60% of their operating costs and the rest is paid from the tax payer's pockets. The FoMS were only looking for less than 10% help.
-What went wrong? I don't know and I can only speculate. Looking at the financial statements, wages increased from about $261,000 for the 2008-09 season to over $410,000 for the 2009-10, over $507,000 for the 2010-11 season to $581,500 for the 2011-12 season. Was this due to an over zealous area manager, lack of communications or oversight by the board of GNSS or an attempt to try and keep key operations staff employed all year instead of having to reinvent the wheel every year with new staff or all of the above?
-What is the solution? Try and keep wages below $350,000 while still maintaining a quality and safe product. Increase utilization with attractive learn to ski programs. Remind non-skiers that for most people of any age that it is much easier and quicker to learn to ski than it is to learn to skate and a lot more fun when your done. A good instructor will have most new skiers skiing from the top of the chairlift down the easiest run after one lesson. Learning to snowboard has a little longer learning curve but the majority of snowboarders are also skate boarders. The Whitehorse market is not even close to reaching it's full potential. Who ever recommended that the new chairlift should also have a loading conveyer at the loading area was brilliant. I had never heard of one before and after experiencing riding the new chairlift I found it the smoothest, easiest, slickest loading of any lift or tow that I have ever ridden. Very important because this lift is loading skiers and riders of all ages, sizes and abilities.
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Don McLaughlin on Sep 30, 2013 at 1:07 pm
Personally I don't recommend any FoMS volunteers touch the chairlift unless they are one of the former Mt. Sima lift mechanics for two reasons. Firstly, I am not sure if FoMS carries liability insurance and two, I understand that the CoW has taken ownership of the chairlift so it should be their responsibility.
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Joel on Sep 30, 2013 at 9:30 am
The City of Whitehorse does not own the equipment on the hill except for the buildings and now the lift and a groomer that the Yukon Government purchased from GNSS. GNSS is currently selling off the other mechanical assets trying to dig their way out of their fiscal mismanagement so their shouldn't be any great charges of maintenance as B. Foster claims.
Once there is a real business plan in place that takes into account our climate and number of potential users, I support what the city has decided.
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north_of_60 on Sep 28, 2013 at 11:37 am
How the FOMS choose to address the maintenance concerns B.F. raises will say a lot about the organization, it's members, and their actual commitment to the facility. Will volunteers step forward and provide the minimum maintenance required or will they walk away out of spite now that the City won't feed their cash cow?
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Atom on Sep 28, 2013 at 1:44 am
The COW can now float it (as it always has)until the Friends or GNSS can get about raising it's own money for operations, as it should have been doing all along.
Good, sound decision for all by City Council.
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B. Foster on Sep 27, 2013 at 12:34 am
So sad to see the number of voices shrilly pointing and wagging fingers about Sima.
I hope the COW knows what it's gotten itself into sheerly from a maintenance point of view. Mechanical things don't like to sit inactive for long periods of time. It causes all sorts of complications depending on how long things are left to sit. Gauling of bearings, drying of seals, condensation in housings / cases...there are more I'm sure but it's getting late and I haven't eaten.
Suffice to say that when I was at Sima there was a preventative maintenance routine in place, heavy emphasis on preventative. It wasn't perfect due the nature and prevalence of the high staff turnover of staff, but it was there. Is there currently such a routine in place? Has the oil in the Cat been addressed or is it sitting there bathing in its own acidified oil from last year? Are all the "requirements" for lift inspections being addressed? Has the maintenance staff been let go? Is anyone spinning the lift periodically or is it simply left for the exposed portions of the bearings to gaul and cause trouble down the line, maybe for someone else if the lift is sold off? If the lift is being spun, who is doing it? Are they aware that the lift logs need to be maintained as well?
These are just a smattering of concerns sheerly from an equipment standpoint and are concerns I suspect when it comes time to deal with insuring the facility for operations again.
So sad.
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north_of_60 on Sep 26, 2013 at 2:41 pm
Users [not tax dollars] support two golf courses in town, and there are likely more skiers and borders than golfers. Of course golfers put the money they get from users into maintaining the course, not high-paying management jobs like the ski hill did. The ski hill has been little more than a scam to get more government money for their friends.
Perhaps this Mayor and Council can't be conned as easily as the last bunch.
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Wolfe on Sep 26, 2013 at 1:28 pm
I have to agree with 'don't know jack". User pay, or at least user pay the majority.
Mr. McLaughlin raises a lot of valid points. The one point he seems to be missing is that this facility requires major government cash input year over year over year, it has yet to be even close to be self sustainable, yet the perception is that the tax payers should continue to pump money into it.
How about this..
Fund raising..
The Yukon Quest does it..through raffles.
Baseball does it.. through raffles.
Curling does it..BINGO and Cash Calendars.
..need I go on..
OH.. a facility with a capacity for 2000 skiers per day..easy peasy 2000 members at 200/year is $400K otherwise
the membership.. 800 committed members at 500 bucks each covers $400K.
Enough said..
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Errrr on Sep 26, 2013 at 12:48 pm
Don McLaughlinnnnnn.....too long.
And it would be a good ski hill if it had been built on the Mountain behind it...do we blame you for this? You sound like you should know.
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don't know Jack on Sep 26, 2013 at 8:05 am
Mr McLaughlin,
Here is plan "B": Let the "Friends of Sima" pay for it themselves.
Simple really.
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Don McLaughlin on Sep 26, 2013 at 3:43 am
Because of my long history in the original development of Mount Sima and continued involvement over the years I have always followed the progress of Mount Sima in the two newspapers and Mount Sima's Face book page. It has been my principal connection with the Yukon since leaving some 20 years ago. I have closely followed the saga since this spring and I was astounded that the CoW did not approve of covering The Friends of Sima's request for $65,700 to assist in opening Mount Sima this year. This is equivalent to a Talle Starbucks coffee for everyone in Whitehorse. I don't think that they really evaluated what the total cost could be if Mount Sima does not open this year. The operation of Mount Sima during the winter months can generate almost $1,000,000 of economic activity in wages and purchase of goods, services and materials in Whitehorse. The sale of ski and snowboard equipment and clothes can generate thousands of dollars for Whitehorse retailers which can be lost if the ski area does not open. If the retailers have already purchased these items they will be forced to dump this inventory possibly at a loss at some outside discount stores.
As for the CoW's estimate that they might spend $65,500 just to mothball Mount Sima for the year, I believe that they are looking through rose coloured glasses. They still have to maintain the access road and they will have to heat the buildings above freezing temperatures to prevent damage to the floors and foundations from frost heaves if the buildings are not heated. There is real potential of losses from theft and vandalism. If they want the ski area to start up again next year will not be as simple as turning off a switch this year and turning it back on next year and expecting everything to be the same. Start up costs could be two to three times higher than getting the ski area started this year. It will be more difficult and costly to groom two years vegetation re-growth off the ski runs than a single years growth. Many of the skilled staff for snowmaking, grooming and lift maintenance may still be available to the ski area this year but possibly not next year. This would then require the cost of trying to hire this expertise from outside the Yukon and hoping that you don't end up with some other ski area's problem employee. We don't want history to repeat it's self. There will be some that know what I mean.
Mount Sima enjoyed 30% and 10% winter revenue growth in the two years operation with the new chair lift and could possibly have another 10-15% growth this year. If Mount Sima doesn't operate this winter, revenues could possible set back as much as 20% and this projected shortfall would have to be added to next years start up costs. The biggest impact on next years costs if Mount Sima does not run this year will be the loss of public support that the Friends of Sima have been able to generate this year. This group has just been kicked in the nether regions by the CoW and will be almost impossible to generate near the same level of support from the public after Mount Sima has been dead for a year. The motivation and confidence will not be the same as now when the new ski season is on the doorstep. YTG and/or the CoW will have to restore this motivation and confidence with some up front money next year if they want Mount Sima to succeed. The nay Sayers will say let it die and the know it all experts who wouldn't know one end of a ski pole from the other will say to ski at Watson Lake or Dawson. There is huge different between a 2000 skier per day capacity ski area 15 minutes from your door and a small ski area hundreds of kilometres away with less than half the vertical drop and a capacity of 300 skiers per day.
Closing Mount Sima for the winter will have as much if not more impact on children, youth and families of Whitehorse than if the City decided to close the swimming pool for the winter at the CGC or to shut down all hockey programs. It would be difficult to find another activity that is relevant to take its place. Competitive users would be forced to leave the Yukon if they want to continue to train and compete. Mount Sima trained competitors have achieved a top 10 level in national competitions and have metalled in provincial competitions. It was even reported that Mount Sima has even achieved some national recognition when some outside ski clubs asked if they might hold training camps at Mount Sima this winter. The interesting thing about this whole debate over to support or not support Mount Sima is that the protesters seem to be all noise and no substance. I did not see one article where any person opposed to Mount Sima stood up and made a public presentation of opposition. On the positive side I also never saw even one comment from any skier or rider complaining that the facilities at Mount Sima were no good.
I sure hope that the Friends of Sima can quickly find a plan B. I can think of only one other city in Canada or possibly in North American that has a community ski area that is equivalent to Mount Sima that's essentially on everyone's doorstep and that is the greater Vancouver area with it's three north shore ski areas. Whitehorse may not realize what it has until it is gone, gone, gone.
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June Jackson on Sep 24, 2013 at 12:28 pm
The SIMA controversy has done a lot of damage in our community, and feelings run so strong on this issue that I am sure some of our politicians are going to see their political aspirations in the toilet when it comes time to vote again. I have several friends that support SIMA, and even they are tired of the BS.
I'd like to remind everyone, that SIMA has bilked us for MILLIONS of dollars and I am quite sure will manage to bilk us for more. On page 10 of their financial statement (http://mountsima.com/financials/) in the last paragraph it reads "The Society" is not exposed to credit risk as the majority of its revenue comes from government agencies...How could this "audited" report make this declaration without secured revenue?? Begging year to year can not be considered 'secure'. The proof is on the table..they are a credit risk.. Take a look at page 9 if you go to check this out. MILLIONS in donations..where did it all go? I also did not see a list of local creditors in this report. I'll be looking for 2013.
This is of course, not the end, I don't know what it will take to make GNSS/Friends let go of the COW 'teat'. Is Streiker and Cameron the reasons then that GNSS/Friends keep badgering Council?
Council (all but 2), Mayor Curtis, thank you for conserving taxpayer money. I am sure as well, that many of you felt pressure from friends and family and it was likely pretty hard to bring in the NO vote..I am appreciative of the conflict you face..but you voted with the best interests of the majority in mind, which is what elected officials should be doing.
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Steve Fraser on Sep 24, 2013 at 11:23 am
Reckless spending priorities is what pushed GNSS over the edge. No doubt, several of those reckless spenders are part of the "friends of Sima," and clearly cannot be trusted in financial matters. A complete forensic audit is required to establish which individuals are directly responsible for this tragic failure or if the whole organization has severe competency issues. Either way, heaping additional funds on group of people who have proven themselves unreliable at best would be an utterly irresponsible use of public money.
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Nice work on Sep 24, 2013 at 9:57 am
THANK YOU, City of Whitehorse, for sticking to your guns on this. Very sound reasoning presented by Council.
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J.M. on Sep 24, 2013 at 7:50 am
I completely agree with the majority of the council on this decision. The money they are asking for is just a band aid solution.
With the 800 pledges, I'm still not convinced they would get all the money from this. 800 people even in our smaller population size is still not a large demographic. Also if local business leaders feel it's a viable business route, they should consider investing in it themselves.