Minimum wage review makes chamber uneasy
Any move to raise the territory's $9-hourly minimum wage might carry serious drawbacks, the Whitehorse Chamber of Commerce warned today.
Any move to raise the territory's $9-hourly minimum wage might carry serious drawbacks, the Whitehorse Chamber of Commerce warned today.
Community Services Minister Elaine Taylor is formally requesting that the Yukon's Employment Standards Board review the minimum wage, which is among the country's lowest.
"Yukon seeks to ensure a fair and equitable work environment for our workforce, and it is important to ensure that the minimum wage in Yukon is adequate,” Taylor said Thursday.
"The Yukon government looks forward to the outcome of the review and receiving the board's deliberations regarding Yukon's minimum wage."
The last review, conducted in 2005, resulted in an increase to the minimum wage rate as well as an annual boost to reflect the Consumer Price Index (CPI).
"I am very pleased that the minister has requested that the board undertake this review and board members are keen to start the process,” said board chair Lori Lavoie.
"The board will be convening shortly to begin its work on this matter.”
The board has an arm's-length relationship with the government, with members nominated from both employer and employee stakeholder groups. It is mandated to uphold the Employment Standards Act, which sets out the minimum terms and conditions of employment that must be adhered to by employers and employees.
Chamber president Rick Karp said the review may not be necessary.
"I think it is a mistake jumping on the bandwagon,” he told the Star this morning.
"I think we are already tied to the Consumer Price Index, and to raise minimum wage and stay tied to the CPI will cause problems for business owners.”
The minimum wage, as some argue, was never meant to be a social safety net, Karp said.
"You have to look at who actually gets minimum wage – students and people without experience and education. It gives them the opportunity to get a job and to get experience so they can climb the ladder.”
In the last three or four years, Karp noted, there has been a significant influx of foreign workers into the community.
"The starting wages in most of the low-wage industries has gone up, often around $11 an hour. We call them starting wages, by the way, because it is insinuated that you will be starting there and then moving up.
"Many local businesses, to their credit, have said that they don't want to be a minimum-wage employer. If we raise minimum wage, hypothetically, to $10 an hour, it is likely to cause those employers to raise their wages to $10.50 or even a dollar above minimum. This causes what we call ‘wage compression,' where $11 an hour employees start earning $11.50, all the way along until all of a sudden, employers find themselves no longer able to afford employing students and first-time workers, the very group minimum wage was intended for.”
Comments (14)
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Francias Pillman on Dec 1, 2011 at 12:43 pm
Spare us the stereotypes paws. Do you work with any? Or do you just listen to what people believe all these foreign workers are about. Well I work with them. I don't care what country you are from, speaking English should be a bonafide requirement of entry into Canada. They send all their money back home so more can come here, because it's literally a free ride. That's not helping our economy at all. And spare us the rhetoric about "houses, food, and cars" Slowly our Canadian culture is being erased and replaced with people who could care less about our country and just come for the money.
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Yukoner on Dec 1, 2011 at 12:12 pm
Firstly, I don't think minimum wage should be raised. Market forces should take care of this and I get Rick Karp's point about minimum wage affecting the whole scale of wages.
On the second matter of immigrant workers, I brought over a worker through the nominee program for my small business. I can tell you that I was required to pay this individual over $15/hour (and happily complied by paying $16). It is also incumbent upon the employer to prove that they were unable to hire anyone suitable locally, after a period of advertising.
I do wonder if government is interfering too much in the labour market through excessive safety net measures, though. Social Assistance pays enough that many would rather collect it than work for $9 - $12/hour. Indeed, I recall reading a local article that found a single person working full time for $9 would make a little less than they would on Social Assistance. We have struck a serious blow to employment incentive.
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Paws on Dec 1, 2011 at 8:54 am
Unlike most born raised Yukon kids, immigrant workers show up for work on time, do an honest day's work, don't whine and complain or blow off the Saturday morning shift. These foreign workers appreciate the fact they have a job. Many kids think that they are "entitled" to $18/hr just for showing up even if they don't have any experience and don't do much. This entitlement attitude is rampant in the Yukon.
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anti karp on Nov 30, 2011 at 4:57 pm
unfortunately I am against new foreign workers coming in and taking our entry level jobs. I am tired of going into ct or tim hortons and having the staff not understand me.. our youth and low skilled residents need these jobs. Cmon ytg raise the minimum wage for yukon residents. The cost of living here is out of control
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Not Karp on Nov 30, 2011 at 7:48 am
Mr/Ms(?) Pilman...
I am not Karp - don't like him one bit.
I was speaking generally of the minimum wage - not the worker import program.
I am saying that basing a wage on what people 'need' (or on what we perceive they need - which was the basis for pay inequity systems in our past) is flawed. The system will work if people refuse to work for a wage that is too low, or, rightfully, those jobs will be the jobs that kids or other inexperienced people get.
As for the imported workers, I do not like the program, but I don't think they are getting minimum wage either. I would like to see a post from someone who is actually getting paid $9/hr. My 14 year old kid's starting wage at her first job was higher than that.
There is nothing wrong with having the market influence the wage scale, because it will influence everything else also. Can we all not see everyone saying "whew - it's ok that house prices are now almost half a million dollars - because we raised the minimum wage".
Anti-poverty groups have been asking for a $10 minimum wage since the early 80's. It doesn't mean anything.
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Francias Pillman on Nov 29, 2011 at 11:11 am
Hi mr karp, err I mean whoa!. Your double speak is that of a politician. All length and no substance. No matter what you say the current worker program is racist and is hurting our town. The only one who cries about someone making a decent wage and paying it is the business community. The whole sky will fall is plain BS and you know it.
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bobby bitman on Nov 28, 2011 at 7:00 am
I welcome the newcomers to Canada who are arriving through the nominee program. Nothing against them. However! I object strongly to the concept of bolstering their low wages with promises of Canadian residency and eventually citizenship. Canadian residency and citizenship is being thrown into the wage package to attract foreign workers to multi-national corporations in our territory. I have a problem with our country subsidizing these corporations in this way.
I believe we are getting a lot of great new people in our country, but they deserve living wages as do the Canadians who demand a living wage to work in these companies.
Rick Carp is pretty brave to come out and say he does not believe the minimum wage in the Yukon should be increased from one of the lowest in the country. Business owners have to charge a little more to the rest of us, and pay the working poor better. If I pay another 2 cents for gas, or 10 cents for a coffee, so be it.
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Whoa! on Nov 28, 2011 at 4:57 am
A lot of complex issues are getting mashed into this discussion.
1. the minimum wage is the training wage. It is for people who are new to the workforce, such as students, or people who need to develop some skills.
2. Wages are not, and should not, be based on what a person "needs". This principle was set aside many years ago - because the result of it was that men were paid way more than women for the same work because it was assumed they needed to support a family and the working woman did not.
3. There is no "poverty line" - one must consider all subsidies, tax breaks and allowances given to balance lower incomes, and must also consider how the income is being measured. Is it a market basket measure? Is there a low income cut off? Does it vary between single person or couple households to families?
4. Very few, if any people in Yukon earn minimum wage - certainly not the folks at tims or CTC. Ask them.
5. If the minimum wage is raised to the point that vendors have to raise their prices (and they will), the opportunities for your children and mine and anyone else needing workplace training will be gone. We, as the fickle society we are, believe that if we must pay more, we should get more, and no 14-year old or other inexperienced person is going to intuitively know how to behave at work without an opportunity to be trained.
The market should be allowed to determine the wages - if they are too low, no-one will work, and if they go up - all other wages and salaries (and houses etc) will also go up because people tend to believe they have a particular value, and often it is relative to the minimum wage.
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Sylvia Burkhard on Nov 28, 2011 at 4:24 am
I find it mind-boggling that Karp is saying the minimum wage is for students and people without experience and education. Students work to get experience and education in the work force, they learn to be responsible, on time and work ethics, how the hell are they supposed to do this when all the entry level jobs are taken by "foreign workers". Foreign workers who, by the way were championed by Karp and his buddies. I find it insulting when we had minister in the Fentie regime state that "Yukoners don't want to wash hospital floors". We are quite happy to wash floors at a decent wage that supports the 200% raise in house prices, not a crappy on call situation which is how the Yukon government seems to be running everything these days.
Raise the minimum wages to reflect the cost of living for those who need these jobs, students, people who may need to supplement a spouses income etc. Unbelievable that foreign workers rights are put above Yukoners, why are taxpayers dollars going to subsidize big box and franchises, seriously, hire Yukoners, invest some time and training and use the minimum wage for what it was intended, a stepping stone to the future. When I hire someone to work for me I pay at least $20 and don't expect to be compensated I guarantee that I will never hire a foreign worker and really don't know why our government is either, its not like people aren't willing to work, guess it's a lot easier when you have a workforce who is only here to make some money to send home. Like I say, mind-boggling, only in the Yukon, thanks to the Chamber of Commerce!
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YUKONGUY on Nov 27, 2011 at 3:04 pm
it's pathetic when the min wage is below the poverty line!
When ever they talk about raising the min wage it's funny how all the well to do people complain!
I Like Marcy said. 13/h!
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Doug Rutherford on Nov 27, 2011 at 7:38 am
I'm sorry, but if you can't afford to pay your employees a decent wage, why are you still in business? Sell out to someone who's competent enough to generate enough revenue to treat their employees with some modicum of respect.
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marcy on Nov 26, 2011 at 11:25 am
sorry karp. We cant all be millionaires like you. I along with thousands of other yukoners welcome a pay raise. Hell id go for 13 an hour in this high priced territory. right now a majority of yukoners are underpaid and overworked
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Steve E on Nov 26, 2011 at 8:16 am
Yup, low wages and high rents. I take it the Chamber is big on promoting foreign workers to satisfy big corporate employers like CTC and T. Hortons.
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YukonMax on Nov 26, 2011 at 1:53 am
"You have to look at who actually gets minimum wage – students and people without experience and education."
So, if you currently hold any of these jobs, you are uneducated and don't deserve to make a living. Thanks Mr. Karp.
Is this exactly how you members wish the message to be passed along? Really?
Nowadays, it's easier to hire immigrants that don't know any better as far as labor conditions and laws. They are much easier to pacify as they really need that stipend you call wages. In return, "WE" the Yukoners have to make do with a work force that have no clue what they are selling, and won't make eye contact with the customers in order to avoid answering a question they can't understand.
All that at premium price!