Photo by Vince Fedoroff
ANOTHER VEHICLE-PEDESTRIAN INCIDENT – Whitehorse RCMP investigate after a pedestrian was struck on Second Avenue at Lambert Street in December 2019. City council is being asked to approve a study into the impacts of possibly reducing the speed limit on the busy avenue.
City council is being asked to approve a study to assess the impact of reducing the speed limit in the downtown core to 40 kilometres an hour.
City council is being asked to approve a study to assess the impact of reducing the speed limit in the downtown core to 40 kilometres an hour.
City administration is recommending council amend the capital budget by $15,000 to cover the cost of the study.
Council is scheduled to vote on the recommendation next Monday.
The proposal to reduce the speed limit downtown arose out of the Second Avenue Corridor Study into how traffic flow and safety could be improved.
Reducing the speed limit to 40 km/h was one option laid out in the study, as was reconfiguring the four lanes to three lanes with a turning lane, just like Fourth Avenue.
It was noted at a meeting in February by administration that if the speed limit was reduced on Second Avenue, it should be reduced throughout the downtown for consistency.
Coun. Dan Boyd raised an issue at Monday’s council meeting around how the administration was calling the initiative the Downtown Speed Reduction Project.
To be clear, Boyd suggested, it should be called the speed reduction study, as reducing the speed limit is just an option at this point, not a foregone conclusion.
“We have not made a decision,” he said.
Others agreed.
The administrative report on Monday noted the request to look at reducing the speed came out of the February meeting.
“To better understand potential impacts to the transportation network as a result of the proposed speed reduction and its expected effectiveness in the context of the downtown area, Administration is proposing that a brief engineering study be completed before bringing a bylaw amendment forward to council for the speed reduction,” says the administrative report.
“The study will also provide an indication of the estimated costs to implement this speed reduction.”
Coun. Steve Roddick requested that the study also look at the issue of enforcement.
Mayor Dan Curtis told his council colleagues when he drives to work from Riverdale travelling at the 50 km/h speed limit, drivers race by him doing 90 km/h.
Taylor Eshpeter, the city’s manager of engineering services, told council if the $15,000 is approved, council should have something to look at in about 1 1/2 months.
Eshpeter said the proposal to reduce the speed limit will raise many questions, “particularly about potential real or perceived negative impacts.
“Therefore, Administration would like to complete work upfront of the potential amendment to provide a better understanding of the impacts of a blanket speed reduction to the downtown area,” says the administrative report presented by Eshpeter.
The Second Avenue Corridor Study showed that between 2012 and 2017, seven pedestrians were struck by vehicles, and there were three incidents involving cyclists.
Most recently, a man died in November 2019 after he was struck crossing Second Avenue at the Elliott Street crosswalk.
Second Avenue is among the city’s busiest roadways.
The corridor study showed there are between 18,000 and 20,000 vehicles that use Second Avenue every day, compared to 10,000 to 13,000 that use Fourth Avenue.
It also showed there is a significant increase in the survival rate of people who are struck by a vehicle moving at 40 km/h compared to being struck by one travelling at 50 km/h.
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Comments (33)
Up 0 Down 0
Dentist on Apr 27, 2020 at 4:26 pm
Speed bumps.
Up 23 Down 1
North_of_60 on Apr 24, 2020 at 11:13 pm
@Paula T is correct. People have told every Mayor & Council for 30 years that 2nd Ave & Main needs Left Turn arrows like 4th & Main, and every Mayor & Council spends the money that could pay for the lights on useless studies.
What exactly is their problem?
Up 21 Down 1
Jobless on Apr 24, 2020 at 10:59 pm
Can I get a job with the city? I know - reduce the speed to 40 kph, oh wait that didn't work - can we try 20 kph? Can I get a raise? Oh wait that didn't work can we try 0 kph? Hey it worked - can I be director?
Up 6 Down 8
One One-Lesser-Voice on Apr 24, 2020 at 6:02 pm
OMG Dan Curtis
You could use this money to pay KZA to design those fabulous contemporary buildings or give it to the KSA to make signage for their paved snowmobile trails.
Up 3 Down 7
Perspective on Apr 23, 2020 at 9:13 pm
@pizza, if you can see all that while your driving your obviously not paying enough attention to your driving. I would suggest immediate remedial action. Let's make it safe for everyone out there.
Up 24 Down 0
Paula T on Apr 23, 2020 at 4:39 pm
OMG City of Whitehorse, this is the biggest waste of money I have ever heard of! Please, please don't spend money this way. As someone who has driven Second Ave. for 30 years, I can tell you that the issue is not speed (well speed is an issue but reducing the speed limit won't address any of the issues, including how fast people drive - it will only magnify the issue.) The real issue is that there is so much going on on that road - there are cars parked on each side, obscuring views of the corners, four lanes of traffic to pay attention to and then, pedestrians are allowed to cross at every corner, and all but a few are uncontrolled crossings. It is really hard for a driver, especially if you happen to be switching lanes, to see pedestrians. In addition, most people either have to wait in a really long line on the outside lane or risk weaving in and out of lanes to avoid getting stuck at main street behind the left lane. Reducing speed limits will only magnify this issue. There are two very simple ways to address concerns on second ave:
1. Create a few more controlled pedestrian crossings and then block off pedestrian traffic on all other corners (similar to the blocking across from the YG building)
2. Put turning lanes on Main Street. It's just crazy that there aren't any. This is a huge contributor to the weaving in and out of traffic, and is one of the reasons it is difficult to see pedestrians on any of the corners close to main
But don't change the speed. That's just stupid. It will also make people use fourth, at just as fast a pace. And don't spend a ridiculous amount of money studying this when you could just put turning lights on Main and put the rest to constructing controlled crossings.
Up 40 Down 1
LA on Apr 23, 2020 at 9:59 am
Mayor Dan Curtis,
Would the drivers racing by you at 90km/hour have obeyed the law if the speed limit was 10km/hour slower? People that go almost double the speed limit in the downtown/Riverdale area are not acting rationally. Adjusting the speed limit won't change that...
Up 33 Down 2
Max Mack on Apr 23, 2020 at 7:34 am
The media and the politicians and the activists keep throwing out the recent pedestrian-related traffic incidents as though this is proof that speed is the problem.
I have yet to see any study of these incidents.
Meanwhile, CoW plows ahead with a "speed study". You know where this is going.
Up 30 Down 1
Always Questions on Apr 22, 2020 at 6:29 pm
This leads me to think that all 7 pedestrian hits were due to vehicle driver's excessive speed, is that the case? All 7 pedestrians were crossing using a marked crosswalk? Lower the limit by 10 km/hr for drivers and we think that is going to correct pedestrian behaviour, how?
Are we not all in this together? CoW needs to listen to the people that pay them.
Anyone heard of the KISS principle? An enforcement blitz (pedestrians & vehicle drivers) along second should be coordinated immediately, no consultants required, surely staff could handle that project?
Both pedestrians and drivers know the rules! Neither are stupid, we have standardized speed limits and more crossing options than we ever had with the re-vamping of city streets over the years. I kind of resent having to cow-tow to another dumb CoW over-reaction.
Up 24 Down 5
martin on Apr 22, 2020 at 5:19 pm
What a waste Mayor Dan. Unfortunately, he'll leave us saddled with tons of debts (new Blds, poor managements, etc) payable only with future (gigantics) Property Tax increases.
Up 42 Down 1
Pizza on Apr 22, 2020 at 5:12 pm
I’ll save you the $15k: get the cops to actually patrol and enforce laws.
I see countless MVA violations every single time I’m on the road. Expired tags, no tags, no headlights, failing to signal, unsecured loads, speeding, running red lights, rolling stops, yapping on cell phones, no seatbelts and on and on and on.
Up 47 Down 2
Factual fuel on Apr 22, 2020 at 4:19 pm
Twice illegal walkers were crossing 2nd Ave right at the bus stop across from A&W not anywhere near the push buttoned signed crossing. One lady had gotten off the bus and was pulling a suitcase but couldn't be bothered with the regular crosswalk. Out she came without even looking around and broke the law in plain site for all to see. The other occasion a guy was coming from a&dub with a coffee and perhaps thought he would miss his bus if he took the proper route so out he came, crossed illegally and never got creamed while being so foolhardy. Some pedestrians wake up as your giving the law abiding ones a bad name. Pedestrians can pay fines too.
Up 38 Down 1
My Opinion on Apr 22, 2020 at 3:01 pm
I also agree with the comment below that this is not the time for meeting and studies of any kind. After all what traffic are you going to study. How do we choose these folks?
Up 49 Down 3
My Opinion on Apr 22, 2020 at 2:56 pm
I know I will never get hit as I wait for an opening and I make eye contact and don’t leave the curb till it is safe. Isn’t that a pile of Rocket Science?
Up 50 Down 4
My Opinion on Apr 22, 2020 at 2:54 pm
Start fining some of these Point and Walk People. I have been walked out in front of by people who feel some sort of power from this activity.
Up 49 Down 1
Groucho d'North on Apr 22, 2020 at 11:28 am
This is a people problem as it is the drivers who determine what speed they will operate their vehicle. Many become impatient when following another driver who is going slow triggering the dangerous driving habits. Others are poor time managers and find themselves late for whatever- so they drive faster. This is not rocket science. Put more law enforcement on the streets in plain sight and apply the laws already in place. More distracted drivers would also be caught and the money from their fines could probably cover the cost of more officers keeping the streets safer.
Up 58 Down 0
Max Fraser on Apr 22, 2020 at 9:55 am
Waste of money. Let's deal with the enforcement side for a few years then revisit. Rules without enforcement make a mockery of whatever it is they are trying to do. Speed limits in place can work if made to work.
Up 18 Down 2
Citizens of the Idiocracy on Apr 22, 2020 at 7:13 am
Finally Miles - You are beginning to realize the idiocy behind the veil of democracy... Welcome to Idiocracy Miles! We have been waiting...
Up 36 Down 2
Citizens of the Idiocracy on Apr 22, 2020 at 7:09 am
We call for a study of all the studies broken down as follows: Costs, time to complete, what was studied, was there another study or similar study required, was the project implemented, were there cost overruns, and who got the contract, and what is the connection between the contractor and government - Friends, family etc.
Then apply this same study of the studies to YG.
Up 40 Down 1
Rose T A Stone on Apr 21, 2020 at 10:03 pm
So instead of going after the violators, they go to stop the law obider.
Guess what, if you put the speed limit to zero, there will be no accidents...
Up 22 Down 9
JC on Apr 21, 2020 at 8:25 pm
What's going to cost $15,000 bucks? Just put the speed limit down to 40 Klicks for a few months and see how it works. Who gets the big bread.
Up 43 Down 0
Bernd Steiner on Apr 21, 2020 at 7:45 pm
Why the heck do you need another study, can't you see every day
what is going on?
Up 36 Down 2
Jim on Apr 21, 2020 at 7:04 pm
So who is being gifted $15k to “study” to put up new speed limit signs. I guess it’s cheaper to give the money to a study than to do anything to fix the problem. I guess all they are looking for is to raise the survival rate of the people getting hit. Have none of these supposedly qualified people never been to another city? It’s simple, light controlled traffic and cross walks on any 4 lane street. That’s what everyone else does.
Up 35 Down 1
Yukon Justice on Apr 21, 2020 at 6:23 pm
What about the rest of the city where speeders rule?
Up 15 Down 6
BnR on Apr 21, 2020 at 6:14 pm
Mathew, a 1:1.4 hit ratio per year is acceptable?
Bet of you were one of them you wouldn’t think so.
Up 25 Down 13
Barbara Fred on Apr 21, 2020 at 5:47 pm
Having read the discussions and comments; why not put up crosswalk signs that flash when someone is crossing? Have it on every block along 2nd avenue. (?)
Up 42 Down 0
Tater on Apr 21, 2020 at 5:41 pm
So the city is going to do a study of traffic at a time when patterns are not normal due to CV issues.
I agree with those people who suggest enforcing existing laws will, IMHO, significantly reduce potential hazards.
Up 44 Down 4
Guncache on Apr 21, 2020 at 5:34 pm
You want to do a study? Do a study on pedestrians who cross the street and don't watch traffic, their eyes on their cell phone or electronic game or talking on their cell phone
Up 45 Down 8
Oya on Apr 21, 2020 at 3:46 pm
OMG. No. Just NO! Reducing the speed is NOT the answer! Traffic barely flows as it is!!!
This road is THE main artery for vehicles. Force pedestrians to take some responsibility for their safety!!!
Put in designated pedestrian crossings at every second intersection along 2nd Ave. Slap pedestrians with big fines for crossing where they are not allowed to cross and fine them for jay-walking (except maybe on Main Street where traffic is slowed already).
Reducing the speed to 40 will only result in longer bottlenecks and traffic that doesn't move at all. Do you really need an expensive study to tell you that?
Up 32 Down 6
Max Mack on Apr 21, 2020 at 3:45 pm
So, Mayor Dan's anecdotal evidence and personal bias is driving this policy? Undoubtedly backed by CoW bureaucrats who seem to think that everyone that drives is a cave-dwelling troglodyte.
Many people live in Riverdale. 2nd Avenue is their only practical route to and through the downtown core. Perhaps Mayor Dan should live a day in their shoes.
Up 60 Down 4
Miles Epanhauser on Apr 21, 2020 at 2:37 pm
I have enough of city studies and surveys.
Staff often undertake multiple surveys and studies on the same issue then ignore them.
And council presents half baked interest and questions without challenging staff.
Up 41 Down 10
Not Dan Curtis on Apr 21, 2020 at 2:06 pm
No, no and double no. You shouldn't be having meetings anyway with the "rona' going around.
Up 39 Down 21
Matthew on Apr 21, 2020 at 2:02 pm
So.. Mayor Curtis, how do you know they are traveling at 90 kph in a 50? Do you also think these speeders will slow down to 80 after a 40 speed limit? LOL! A study says in 5 years 7 people were hit! To me that's a damn good ratio really.